Glossary entry (derived from question below)
German term or phrase:
aussermärkisch
English translation:
outside the district boundary
Added to glossary by
Timoshka
Apr 7, 2022 02:45
2 yrs ago
31 viewers *
German term
aussermärkisch
German to English
Social Sciences
History
I'm reading some official documentation of a WWII air battle over Buchenberg, Germany (1944), which mentions 22 American fliers were killed. That is followed by the line:
"Hiezu kamen vier Tote aus dem aussermärkischen Bezirk Unterkürnach, des Staatswaldes, so dass hier 26 Mann bestattet wurden."
"Hiezu kamen vier Tote aus dem aussermärkischen Bezirk Unterkürnach, des Staatswaldes, so dass hier 26 Mann bestattet wurden."
Proposed translations
(English)
| 3 +3 | outside the district boundary |
Gordon Matthews
|
| 4 -1 | outer Märkischen |
Cillie Swart
|
| 1 +1 | from outside the market-town area - extra muros |
Bourth
|
References
| Info |
Kim Metzger
|
Proposed translations
+3
6 hrs
Gordon Matthews
Germany
Germany
Native in English
Works in field
Germany
translator - copy-editor - proofreader
Native in: English (Variants: US, British, UK) 
Works in: German to English, French to English
Related KudoZ points
:
12
Selected
outside the district boundary
The merit of this translation, "outside the district boundary", is that it is English and does not use a German expression which means nothing to English-speakers.
The sentence might be translated as follows:
"Added to this, there were four dead from Unterkürnach, an area of the state forest outside the district boundary, so that 26 men were buried here."
I'm not sure of this translation, because I don't know the geography of this part of Germany, so I don't know which Mark is referred to.
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Note added at 19 hrs (2022-04-07 22:09:21 GMT)
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In response to asker: I don't think your suggested translation works, because it is my understanding that Unterkürnach is an area (Bezirk) within the state forest which lies outside the district boundary. It seems to me that it is assumed that the reader is familiar with the geography of the region and would know which district (Mark) is being referred to, outside of which Unterkürnach lies.
The sentence might be translated as follows:
"Added to this, there were four dead from Unterkürnach, an area of the state forest outside the district boundary, so that 26 men were buried here."
I'm not sure of this translation, because I don't know the geography of this part of Germany, so I don't know which Mark is referred to.
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 19 hrs (2022-04-07 22:09:21 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
In response to asker: I don't think your suggested translation works, because it is my understanding that Unterkürnach is an area (Bezirk) within the state forest which lies outside the district boundary. It seems to me that it is assumed that the reader is familiar with the geography of the region and would know which district (Mark) is being referred to, outside of which Unterkürnach lies.
Note from asker:
| Great insight! Based on your explanation and my knowledge of the local area, do you think "...four dead were brought from an area of the state forest outside the district boundary of Unterkürnach..." would also be possible? |
| Found this, which might help explain the phrase: "Unterkürnach ist ein Gemeindeteil des Marktes Wiggensbach im Landkreis Oberallgäu" |
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Cillie Swart
: nice solution
2 hrs
|
| agree |
Bourth
3 hrs
|
| agree |
philgoddard
: Or you could just say "outlying".
7 hrs
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
Comment: "Vielen Dank!"
-1
3 hrs
Cillie Swart
South Africa
South Africa
Native in English
South Africa
Finance, Legal, Business Texts
Native in: English
Works in: German to English, Dutch to English, Afrikaans to English, and 1 more.
Related KudoZ points
:
4
outer Märkischen
"In addition, there were four dead from the outer Märkischen district of Unterkürnach, of the state forest, so that 26 men were buried here."
Peer comment(s):
| disagree |
Steffen Walter
: Please stop suggesting meaningless Linguee translations.
8 mins
|
|
Thank you for the feedback! Greatly appreciated...
|
+1
6 hrs
from outside the market-town area - extra muros
Wild guess here. Might it be a typo for 'aussermärkTisch' ?
"extra muros : outside the (city) walls : outside the (religious) community : external"
"Buchenberg is"t ein MARKT im bayerisch-schwäbischen Landkreis Oberallgäu."
"Eine Marktgemeinde oder ein MARKT ist ein Ort mit Marktrecht; IN BAYERN, Österreich und Südtirol ist es eine KOMMUNALRECHTLICHE BEZEICHNUNG FÜR EINE GEMEINDE mit einem entweder historischen oder formell verliehenen Marktrecht"
As they say, it could be historical, and is definitely regional. There are some examples on the Web.
"Bis dahin hatte sich am Südhang des Burgberges, in der Spor- und unteren Sackstraße, bereits eine MÄRKTISCHE Siedlung entwickelt, das suburbanum castri Grace der Reinerhof-Urkunde von 1164. In einer Urkunde aus 1147 (nach GÄNSER wohl erst 1151 ausgestellt) ist ein mercator Witelo genannt, der wahrscheinlich auf Graz zu beziehen ist. Von seinem Berufskollegen Pertholdus mercator de Graze (ca. 1150) ist das ausdrücklich gesagt. Es gab also im frühen Markt Graz nicht nur Handwerker, sondern auch Händler."
" in so ferne er zu einer der darin gelegenen städtisch- oder MÄRKTISCH-bürgerlichen Gemeinden gehöret"
"extra muros : outside the (city) walls : outside the (religious) community : external"
"Buchenberg is"t ein MARKT im bayerisch-schwäbischen Landkreis Oberallgäu."
"Eine Marktgemeinde oder ein MARKT ist ein Ort mit Marktrecht; IN BAYERN, Österreich und Südtirol ist es eine KOMMUNALRECHTLICHE BEZEICHNUNG FÜR EINE GEMEINDE mit einem entweder historischen oder formell verliehenen Marktrecht"
As they say, it could be historical, and is definitely regional. There are some examples on the Web.
"Bis dahin hatte sich am Südhang des Burgberges, in der Spor- und unteren Sackstraße, bereits eine MÄRKTISCHE Siedlung entwickelt, das suburbanum castri Grace der Reinerhof-Urkunde von 1164. In einer Urkunde aus 1147 (nach GÄNSER wohl erst 1151 ausgestellt) ist ein mercator Witelo genannt, der wahrscheinlich auf Graz zu beziehen ist. Von seinem Berufskollegen Pertholdus mercator de Graze (ca. 1150) ist das ausdrücklich gesagt. Es gab also im frühen Markt Graz nicht nur Handwerker, sondern auch Händler."
" in so ferne er zu einer der darin gelegenen städtisch- oder MÄRKTISCH-bürgerlichen Gemeinden gehöret"
Peer comment(s):
| agree |
Steffen Walter
: Either this or referring to "Gemarkung", but the conclusion would be the same. Note, though, that the source speaks of the "aussermärkischer Bezirk Unterkürnach des Staatswaldes", i.e. the Unterkürnach portion of the forest (situated extra muros).
1 hr
|
Reference comments
1 hr
Kim Metzger
Mexico
Mexico
Native in English
Works in field
Mexico
Committed to Quality and Service
Native in: English (Variant: US)
Works in: German to English
Related KudoZ points
:
212
Reference:
Info
The County of Mark (German: Grafschaft Mark, French: Comté de La Marck colloquially known as Die Mark) was a county and state of the Holy Roman Empire in the Lower Rhenish–Westphalian Circle. It lay on both sides of the Ruhr river along the Volme and Lenne rivers.
The Counts of the Mark were among the most powerful and influential Westphalian lords in the Holy Roman Empire. The name Mark is recalled in the present-day Märkischer Kreis district in lands south of the Ruhr in North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany. The northern portion (north of the Lippe river) is still called Hohe Mark ("Higher Mark"), while the former "Lower Mark" (between the Ruhr and Lippe Rivers) is—for the most part—merged in the present Ruhr area. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_of_Mark
The Counts of the Mark were among the most powerful and influential Westphalian lords in the Holy Roman Empire. The name Mark is recalled in the present-day Märkischer Kreis district in lands south of the Ruhr in North Rhine-Westphalia, Germany. The northern portion (north of the Lippe river) is still called Hohe Mark ("Higher Mark"), while the former "Lower Mark" (between the Ruhr and Lippe Rivers) is—for the most part—merged in the present Ruhr area. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/County_of_Mark
Note from asker:
| I'm not sure that works, since the area concerned (Buchenberg, Unterkürnach, etc.) is in the far south of Germany, in the Allgäu. |
Discussion
See also https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemarkung#Allgemeine_Zusammenh...