| Pages in topic: [1 2] > | The asker has declined this answer Thread poster: Lancashireman
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I cannot see the justification for retaining this feature on Kudoz:
1) The asker is, by definition, the person who does not know the answer.
2) An answer may attract multiple agrees from other professionals but still be eliminated by ‘the person who does not know the answer’.
3) The option encourages laziness on the part of ‘the person who does not know the answer’ because it merely involves the click of a mouse and does not require any written justification.
... See more I cannot see the justification for retaining this feature on Kudoz:
1) The asker is, by definition, the person who does not know the answer.
2) An answer may attract multiple agrees from other professionals but still be eliminated by ‘the person who does not know the answer’.
3) The option encourages laziness on the part of ‘the person who does not know the answer’ because it merely involves the click of a mouse and does not require any written justification.
4) It also encourages ‘the person who does not know the answer’ to display poor site etiquette.
Often, an asker may wish to reject an answer for the reason that it does not fit in with context (of which they are aware but have carelessly omitted). There is already an adequate mechanism in place (Discussion Box; Comment on your answer etc) for supplementing context and refining ideas that have been submitted. This may even go as far as expressing scepticism. But as regards power of disqualification, ‘the person who does not know the answer’ is surely the least fit to wield the axe.
I have noticed that ‘answer declined’ does not trigger e-mail notifications. Consequently, you may be wondering where your points are at the end of the fortnight, return to the question and find that you were snubbed several days before.
May I therefore politely request that the option to decline answers is scrapped? And while I’m about it, can I also suggest that no PWDNKTA be permitted to ‘just_close’ a question when one or more answers has secured two or more ‘agrees’ (i.e. sufficient to automatically close the question after two weeks anyway)? ▲ Collapse
| | | | DZiW (X)
Ukraine
English to Russian
+ ...
| Andrew, I second that | Jul 15, 2011 |
It's unfair to reject answers or close KudoZ questions without proper reasoning at all!
And such an option will surely trigger ignoring sooner or later.
Surrender (flag the rejector) is not an option.
Indeed, "agrees" are relatively subjective, but it should be taken into account.
All in all, why reject if Asker can just choose another answer?!
I don't buy it.
[Edited at 2011-07-15 20:59 GMT]
| | | | | This function was discontinued in 2006, it does not exist now | Jul 16, 2011 |
Andrew,
This function (where the asker can decline individual answers) does not exist (anymore).
Where do you see it?
This was discussed in a thread in 2007:
http://www.proz.com/forum/kudoz/88108-prozcom_give_me_back_the_button_decline_answer.html#710642
And here is the original announcement from 2... See more Andrew,
This function (where the asker can decline individual answers) does not exist (anymore).
Where do you see it?
This was discussed in a thread in 2007:
http://www.proz.com/forum/kudoz/88108-prozcom_give_me_back_the_button_decline_answer.html#710642
And here is the original announcement from 2006:
http://www.proz.com/forum/kudoz/45397-release_announcement:_improvements_in_the_kudoz_system.html
If you still see this option when you ask a question, or your answer was declined recently by an asker, then it may be a system glitch, or perhaps you (or the asker) are (is) using a very old version of the ProZ user interface???
I just asked a question a few days ago, and I do not see this option at any of the answers. I do remember the button, it used to be under the individual answer, but it is not there anymore. All I can see is two things, one to accept the answer as the most helpful, the other is to post a note to the answerer.
Katalin ▲ Collapse
| | | | Marina Steinbach
United States
Local time: 14:38
Member (2011)
English to German
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| Only the selected answer gets points | Jul 16, 2011 |
The Gloss "ok" simply means the question was closed, an answer was chosen and a glossary entry had been made. It does not mean that YOUR answer was selected.
If you open the question, you will see that the asker accepted the other answerer's answer, not yours. Only the selected answer gets points.
There is a lot of explanation about KudoZ in the FAQ. Have you browsed it yet?
If not, I strongly recommend it, as it explains many things that are complicated and not too intuitive at the beginning.
http://www.proz.com/faq/terminology_term_help.html
I hope this helps
Katalin
| | | | Steffen Walter 
Germany
Local time: 20:38
Member (2002)
English to German
+ ...
| Closing without grading | Jul 16, 2011 |
Katalin Horvath McClure wrote:
Andrew,
This function (where the asker can decline individual answers) does not exist (anymore).
Where do you see it?
Hi Katalin,
I suspect that Andrew was referring to the phenomenon that askers sometimes close questions without grading (my pet peeve in this regard is "Reason: Other") without posting any comment regarding the reason for doing so.
Best regards,
Steffen
P.S. My assumption does not seem to apply, as evidenced by Andrew's subsequent post.
[Edited at 2011-07-16 20:16 GMT]
| | | | Lancashireman
United Kingdom
Local time: 19:38
German to English
TOPIC STARTER | | Submit a Support Request | Jul 16, 2011 |
Andrew,
If I were you, I would submit a support request with this link. This seems very odd, and must be a technical reason for it. I would submit it as a Bug report.
I am wondering if it has to do with an old interface, or maybe the asker is using the email links to interact with KudoZ, and the decline option is still there?
I don't know as I never use the email interface.
I would call the developers' attention to this, as this should not be happening.
Katal... See more Andrew,
If I were you, I would submit a support request with this link. This seems very odd, and must be a technical reason for it. I would submit it as a Bug report.
I am wondering if it has to do with an old interface, or maybe the asker is using the email links to interact with KudoZ, and the decline option is still there?
I don't know as I never use the email interface.
I would call the developers' attention to this, as this should not be happening.
Katalin ▲ Collapse
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| It is possible to decline all answers | Jul 17, 2011 |
The option to decline individual answers was eliminated long ago, but it is still possible to decline all answers to a question.
As explained in a KudoZ FAQ, askers are sent email reminders to grade open KudoZ questions with eligible answers after 5, 7, 9, and 11 days have elapsed since the question was asked.
To stop receiving these reminders the asker has three options:
* Select the most helpful answe... See more The option to decline individual answers was eliminated long ago, but it is still possible to decline all answers to a question.
As explained in a KudoZ FAQ, askers are sent email reminders to grade open KudoZ questions with eligible answers after 5, 7, 9, and 11 days have elapsed since the question was asked.
To stop receiving these reminders the asker has three options:
* Select the most helpful answer
* Close the question without selecting an answer ("Close w/o Grading" )
* Decline all current answers, but leave the question open to receive future answers.
To decline all answers you have to click on the link "None of these answers are appropriate; do not remind me to select one" shown at the top of the list of answers once notifications were sent.
Regards,
Enrique ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Perhaps change it, Enrique? | Jul 17, 2011 |
Hmm.
This explains it, but I don't think the system works the best way.
If the individual declining was eliminated (for good reasons), why do we allow the asker to decline all answers with a single click? It does not make sense to me.
I also don't understand why it makes sense to allow the asker to decline all answers and leave the question open?
This is not fair for many reasons:
1. In this case the question does not count into the asking limit of the asker... See more Hmm.
This explains it, but I don't think the system works the best way.
If the individual declining was eliminated (for good reasons), why do we allow the asker to decline all answers with a single click? It does not make sense to me.
I also don't understand why it makes sense to allow the asker to decline all answers and leave the question open?
This is not fair for many reasons:
1. In this case the question does not count into the asking limit of the asker, therefore there is no motivation to close it. (And basically the asker says "don't even ask me anymore to close it".)
2. The automatic closing (robot) would not work, even if there are at least two agrees to an answer, because the asker declined the answer.
3. There is an option to close without grading, with the reason "No acceptable answers", why not use that?
4. The text of the email is not clear, for example, it does not say that the question will remain open.
5. It seems the only way to stop the reminders is to chose this option.
Futhermore, if the asker selects the "None of these answers are appropriate; do not remind me to select one" option, then the question will remain open, and the answerer will not close it in the future as he/she does not even get reminders about it. The robot cannot close the question if all answers are declined, so what will happen? The question will remain open forever, because anybody can see that the asker declined all answers and basically left the scene for good, so the likelihood of someone posting a brand new answer and get at least two net agrees on it is very slim.
I would suggest changing this system, and get rid of this option.
In the proposed system, when the asker gets the reminder, he can either do nothing, in which case the question remains open and reminders will continue.
If the asker wants to stop the reminders, he has the following options to chose from:
1. Close the question by selecting the most helpful answer.
2. Close the question without selecting an answer ("Close w/o Grading" ) - reason (no acceptable answer)
3. Leave the question open for community grading.
4. Leave the question open, but stop the reminders.
The asker would stop receiving reminders after choosing any of these options.
I think this would be more fair to everybody.
Katalin ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Closing questions = points + proper wrap up | Jul 17, 2011 |
Occasional KudoZ askers do fit into the PWDNKTA category - especially the very occasional ones who STILL do not know the answer after being presented with good suggestions (*sigh!*)
But many if not most askers are consummate professionals who are temporarily blind to the right answer, are seeking a second opinion (or three), or are throwing a particularly knotty question out for discussion. In other words: askers are people who might have made a good stab at answering their own que... See more Occasional KudoZ askers do fit into the PWDNKTA category - especially the very occasional ones who STILL do not know the answer after being presented with good suggestions (*sigh!*)
But many if not most askers are consummate professionals who are temporarily blind to the right answer, are seeking a second opinion (or three), or are throwing a particularly knotty question out for discussion. In other words: askers are people who might have made a good stab at answering their own questions, had they been asked by somebody else.
Askers have access to the full context (even when they provide lots of context) and are best placed to make the final call on what goes into the text, more so than peers who agree or disagree.
For that reason, I think askers should wrap up KudoZ discussions properly when awarding points and say what they finally went with (and why). Some askers do this very well, but it could become more common. Three benefits:
1. The wrap-up summarizes and rounds off the specialist discussion.
2. It is a nice way to acknowledge the effort of everybody involved.
3. It is a good way to showcase one's own professional competence.
Knowing that a proper wrap-up is expected might also deter askers who use KudoZ for questions which are not really difficult enough to warrant a peer discussion.
In the particular case Andrew mentioned, the points have now been awarded on the basis of peer agreement, but the asker has perhaps missed an opportunity to engage constructively with colleagues, and we have no idea what solution was actually used. ▲ Collapse
| | | | B D Finch
France
Local time: 20:38
French to English
+ ...
| Why no points? | Jul 17, 2011 |
The following may go some way to explaining it. I don't understand German, but your example sentence:"The diagnostician diagnoses a diagnostic feature of a disease" is wrong, as a "diagnostic feature" is not itself diagnosed, it is observed and used to diagnose the disease.
Your answer, though it demonstrates the existence of your proposed translation, does not link it to the source term. Your comments to those who agreed with you "Thank you for supporting me" could be taken to imply that you see this as a competition for points, rather than as a forum for helping Askers and building a glossary.
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The asker has the right to keep the question open waiting for more answers while declining the current ones if they are deemed not helpful at all.
Declining one particular answer while keeping the others available was a source of conflicts, as many answerers felt discriminated or perceived these actions as personal.
On the other hand declining all answers is just a way to keep the question open to future answers whithout the pressure of notifications and limits, and it ... See more The asker has the right to keep the question open waiting for more answers while declining the current ones if they are deemed not helpful at all.
Declining one particular answer while keeping the others available was a source of conflicts, as many answerers felt discriminated or perceived these actions as personal.
On the other hand declining all answers is just a way to keep the question open to future answers whithout the pressure of notifications and limits, and it is the same to all answerers.
Askers do not need to know the answer because they are selecting the answer that was most helpful to them, not the "correct" one.
Some improvements to the closing stage of KudoZ are planned but they have no date attached yet. I have recorded Katalin's excellent suggestions in the internal request for future reference.
Regards,
Enrique ▲ Collapse
| | | | | The problem with the current system | Jul 17, 2011 |
Enrique wrote:
Declining one particular answer while keeping the others available was a source of conflicts, as many answerers felt discriminated or perceived these actions as personal.
On the other hand declining all answers is just a way to keep the question open to future answers whithout the pressure of notifications and limits, and it is the same to all answerers.
The problem (or at least a problem) is that with the current wording, no one would know clicking on that option will result in answers being declined. If that’s what that button does, then I find it completely misleading.
In fact, as a first-time KudoZ asker who is still having trouble figuring out how to close his first-ever question, I don’t find myself understanding what any of those buttons will do. There is no explanation on the screen and no tooltips. And as a result of this lack of explanation I am hesitant to click any of those buttons for the fear that I will cause some irreversible undesired action.
So I’m all for some change to the current system. At the bare minimum, there should be some explanation as to what all those buttons actually do.
| | | | | Declining all answers without assigning reasons is rude, and I am being mild!! | Jul 18, 2011 |
And then keeping the question open for further answers shows that the asker has just contempt for the future answerers. It is all the more rude.
If I were to see such an asker, I will just ignore him and he deserves nothing better.
Regards,
N. Raghavan
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